Mott The Hoople's reunion shows have all had the same finale, "Saturday Gigs" into "All The Young Dudes." I love both songs dearly, and the seamless transition from one to the other was a particularly goosebump inducing moment. Since I don't have a cat I can video and have exhausted all of the "One Something A Day For Ten Days" options on Facebook, I posted this--
Mott's "Saturday Gigs" or David Bowie's "Rock N Roll Suicide, which is the better closer?
I was surprised by the results. But, I was more interested in the comments. One particular comment was from my friend and BW colleague, BBJ, who is a fan of Mott, but not the tune, pointing out that, and I am paraphrasing here, it was written during a very fractious time for the band. They had all but broken up and the lyrics seem like forced, phony nostalgia.
This thought had never crossed my mind, not in 45 years of loving "Saturday Gigs." It always felt big. Broadway. Melancholy and sad. A perfect way to go, surrounded by a chorus of goodbyes. But I can see BBJ's point, so much so, that "Saturday Gigs" now makes me think a bit. I still love it, but maybe with only 98% of my heart. Conversely, my defense of the song has made BBJ like it about 2% more than he did.
Another comment questioned whether it was truly a "ballad," going on to say, "What is a ballad?...If a song is slow or heavy or sad, is that a ballad?..,I thought a ballad needed a more specified subject...a love lost, a heroic figure, a cowboy or a woman like in Galveston ....Saturday Gigs is a farewell....a history."
I've always used the term "ballad" for any slow, heartbreaking love song. Regardless of the title, "The Ballad Of Jed Clampett" will never be a ballad to me. There needed to be heartbreak. It couldn't just tell a story, or be slow and heavy. Roxy Music's "In Every Dream Home, A Heartache" is slow and heavy, but by no means is it a ballad. The same could be said for Bowie's 'Rock N Roll Suicide." Both can be read as "heartbreaking," and it could be argued that the Roxy tune IS a love song, albeit to an inflatable doll. Both move me in different ways, but neither moves that part of me the way "Old Friends/Bookends" by Simon & Garfunkel does. Or, say, "God Only Knows."
Feel free to cast your vote for the better closer, Mott or Bowie. But I am more interested in what moves you. It doesn't need to be a "ballad." The Rascals "A Girl Like You" never fails to bring tears of joy to my eyes. That song is about as perfect as a pop record can get.
14 comments:
A complex question. What "moves" me is different than what I might consider a "ballad". I *do* consider unabashed love songs (ie "Never My Love" by the Association) to be different than "ballads" though. "Ballads" to me either (A) have a story to tell or (B) are driven by a performance so moving that the lyrics are secondary. It's a rarity when something has both.
"This Women's Work" by Kate Bush never fails to put a lump in my throat -- no matter how many times I've heard it.
"Wichita Lineman" -- even though there aren't a ton of lyrics -- it doesn't need them.
"Darling Be Home Soon" -- lots of lyrics though I will *never ever* like the "dawdled/toddled" rhyme.
And for a song that actually has "Ballad" in the title: "The Ballad of Danny Bailey" by Elton
These are off the top of my head.
While I love me some Rock/Power-Pop, there ain't no one goin' turn me 'round when I put on some heartfelt ballads!
"This Woman's Work" is a terrific example. First time I heard it was in the John Hughes movie, "She's Having A Baby." A so-so film, but the scene with the Kate Bush song killed me. The lump in my throat was BIG! And while I still love the song, "This Woman's Work" never affected me the same way again. It needed the visuals. A beautiful song, and without question, one of Kate's best. But is it a ballad? I say no, not by my rules.
"Darling Be Home Soon" has a very special memory attached to it and will always affect me in the best possible ways. And it has nothing to do with lyrics. It's when the horns come in on the break that I lose it.
The problem with a "slow, heartbreaking love song" is it requires reading my mail! :-)
As you said when a special memory is attached a "run of the mill" song can send me into the stratosphere -- Bruce's Independence Day breaks my heart in ways unique to me (not that Independence Day is run of the mill). And any of those "Our Songs" when there ain't an "Our" anymore.
Let me throw one out that people might not know but should. Fred Eaglesmith's Water In The Fuel.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UF-83t5Wr_I
Kasey Chambers does a killer cover too.
Slow? -- Check
Love Song? -- Check
Heartbreaking? -- Check Check Check
And don't get me started on the mandolin!
Personally, I think we can analyse stuff too much. 45 years on we can look at Saturday Gigs far differently than it's first release and intention. Originally, it seemed so Mott like to sign off this way and it was. No one ever expected a reunion, welcome though it was.
As for the fractious end, I don't really go with BBJ's thoughts. There was animosity to Ronson joining, but there had always been that in the band. Verden Allen leaving, Mick Ralphs too.
We should also not forget that part of that wonderful first Hunter solo album was part of the latter day Hoople work in progress. Lounge Lizard and Who Do You Love etc. Great songs despite the discontent.
People look at The Hoople album in different ways. I adored it at the time and had a spell of not rating it, but it is great at what it does, different in a lot of ways to what went before, largely because Hunter had firm hands on the wheel.
I still defy anyone to write a song as good as Alice.
Not much one for ballads, but I believe Def Leppard perfected the rock version on Hysteria. Previous ones I used to have memorized were Montrose's "Music Man," Stu Daye's "Sushi" and oh yeah Cheap Trick's "The Flame." You had to be there.
I just want to say one thing here--and every time I think it my mind gets blown to bits--and that is that Ian Hunter is about to turn 80 years old. OK, now I will run head-first into a wall. . .
Muzak McMusics
Thought a bit more about this after lunch...
"Ballads or not?" by your definition? (so I/we have a better feel for what you are looking for -- and I'm randomly picking songs that may stretch the boundaries...and I'm deliberately leaving off things I would consider soul/r&b music -- for the most part -- that give me "the feels")
"Thirteen" by Big Star?
"Goodbye to Love" or "Superstar" by the Carpenters?
"The Name of the Game" -- Abba
"Only Women Bleed" -- Alice Cooper?
"Without You" -- Badfinger/Nilsson?
Pretty much any of the big mellow hits by Barry Manilow like "Mandy"?
"Everything I Own" -- Bread?
"Purple Rain"? "I Want It That Way?" "Total Eclipse of the Heart?" "Two out of Three Ain't Bad"? "Because of You"?
I realize I'm drifting into Shriner's favorite mellow hits, so I'll stop in the "Bs" (even leaving out the Beatles "In My Life")
3 from the same band over 3 decades...
Ruby Tuesday
Angie
Waiting on a friend
The maddening thing about this is the tie into Bowie and Ian Hunter/Mott The Hoople. The Tie in to all of this is Mick Ronson, having played on both tracks originally. Both songs went ages without being performed live:
A story from Rolling Stone Magazine in 2015, prior to Bowie's death ""This has been one of the greatest tours of our lives," Bowie said before the last song of his final Ziggy Stardust concert. "Of all of the shows on this tour, this particular show will remain with us the longest because not only is it — not only is it the last show of the tour, but it's the last show that we'll ever do." The audience shrieked in horror, thinking it meant that Bowie was retiring as opposed to merely doing away with the Ziggy Stardust character. There was only one song that could follow such an announcement: "Rock and Roll Suicide." It's the last song on The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars, focusing on the character's tragic end. Bowie hasn't played the song in 25 years." Here is one of the last performances of "Suicide" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnoyiVZUxUk likely from May 16, 1990. A powerful song, used rarely, and even less rarely as a closing tune.
The songs most closed with on Bowie's last tour were "Suffragette City" the song TURNED DOWN by Ian/Mott before "Dudes" was offered up, and Ziggy Stardust both of whom had arrangements and solo's created by Mick Ronson. The B side to the single is "Quicksand" maybe a better track overall, it depends upon which day it is for me...
Saturday Gigs? The reason it's not closing the show is it is so powerful to the faithful that they won't let the song end. Witness here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pga5ExkwJ90&list=RDPga5ExkwJ90&start_radio=1
The B Side to Saturday Gigs is "The Medley" From the Mott The Hoople Live LP which have both been memorialized again by Mott The Hoople '74 see here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7V_WY4p1vE and here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lrb8Ir_uKMY
Different songs, different urgencies, having seen both songs performed by both artists I am first off -- grateful to have both, but I give the nod to "Saturday Gigs as a closer. It's almost as perfect a Pop masterpiece as "All The Young Dudes" and Ronson's guitar solo and the backing vocals set's the Phil Spectorish Production apart from the "Rock and Roll Suicide" Song. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufG9WEaE1gc
Interestingly I was unable to find a live version of it performed by Ian Hunter and Mick Ronson in their many versions of heading up bands together.
The late, great Johnny Adams - "There Is Always One More Time".
I made a mixtape recently "Songs About Being Lost", based on my responses to a local DJ's requests for songs of that ilk. It was such a bummer that I had to include something upbeat as a closer. Nick Lowe's "Endless Sleep" is the song before it.
Howard Tate -- "Get It While You Can"
Don Covay -- "It's In The Wind"
Sam Cooke -- "Lost And Looking"
I don't know how I missed BW this week. I was working on a project and forgot to check in.
I like "Saturday Gig" at least 10% more, but I stick with my point and disagree with Anything Can Happen. Ronson did not fuel the dischord. He was the final nail.
It began in 1969 when Guy Stevens, manager, found Ian Hunter through an ad and forced him on Mick Ralph's band, Silence, so they could get a record deal.
Bowie and "All The Young Dudes" kept them from breaking up in 1972.
They were never truly a "band of brothers", and it was always a rocky road.
"You Don't Miss Your Water" is my favorite ballad. Both the original by William Bell, and Gram Parsons cover.
Then there's Lefty Frizell's "A Long Black Veil".
And Eno's version of "You Don't Miss Your Water" is even more sublime.
C in California
I think the bittersweetness of Roxy Music's "Mother of Pearl" post intro qualifies it as a ballad.
Kevin Coyne's "House On The Hill" is the saddest song I know, but I'm not sure it's a ballad because it's heartbreak isn't about love.
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